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	<title>Comments on: How do you know what a client expects to pay?</title>
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	<link>http://www.procopytips.com/client-fee-expectations</link>
	<description>Copywriting Tips for Smart Copywriters</description>
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		<title>By: Stacy Ranta</title>
		<link>http://www.procopytips.com/client-fee-expectations/comment-page-1#comment-6402</link>
		<dc:creator>Stacy Ranta</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Aug 2010 07:28:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.procopytips.com/?p=1431#comment-6402</guid>
		<description>Thanks for going into the question a bit more in depth, Dean. I somehow managed to miss this post until now.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for going into the question a bit more in depth, Dean. I somehow managed to miss this post until now.</p>
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		<title>By: Dean Rieck</title>
		<link>http://www.procopytips.com/client-fee-expectations/comment-page-1#comment-6022</link>
		<dc:creator>Dean Rieck</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 24 Jul 2010 01:25:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.procopytips.com/?p=1431#comment-6022</guid>
		<description>Bnonn, 
You&#039;re right about confidence. Sometimes when I&#039;m talking to a fellow freelancer about the business end of freelancing, what I really want to say is, &quot;Just speak confidently and things will work out.&quot; But that&#039;s easier said than done.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Bnonn,<br />
You&#8217;re right about confidence. Sometimes when I&#8217;m talking to a fellow freelancer about the business end of freelancing, what I really want to say is, &#8220;Just speak confidently and things will work out.&#8221; But that&#8217;s easier said than done.</p>
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		<title>By: D Bnonn Tennant</title>
		<link>http://www.procopytips.com/client-fee-expectations/comment-page-1#comment-6019</link>
		<dc:creator>D Bnonn Tennant</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 24 Jul 2010 00:30:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.procopytips.com/?p=1431#comment-6019</guid>
		<description>Great post Dean. I think the art of landing clients is one of the first things a freelance copywriter should seek to become an expert in. For one thing, copywriting is simply salesmanship in print...so if you can&#039;t sell your own services, that&#039;s gotta be a warning sign. For another thing, it&#039;s kind of the key to running a successful business in the long term!

I find it incredibly important to set expectations early. Like you, I make my services &amp; rates available on my website, often send them to prospects when we first start talking. That way they don&#039;t have much excuse to hum and har when I ask them for their budget.

Still, a lot do hedge. However, although Mike describes this as &quot;waiting for me to blink&quot;, I don&#039;t think that&#039;s usually what&#039;s going on. In fact, I think prospects are generally much less &quot;aggressive&quot; that way than freelancers give them credit for. When they hedge, it&#039;s because they actually see you as the expert and are, in a funny kind of way, &quot;looking up to you&quot;. And if they haven&#039;t worked with someone like you before, then they genuinely aren&#039;t sure what a reasonable budget is. Even though they almost certainly have a solid idea of what they can conceivably spend, they don&#039;t want to actually say it for fear of seeming foolish.

Ironically, freelancers are often so unconfident themselves that they don&#039;t see the prospect is looking to them for direction. They think he&#039;s just trying to be cagey. I&#039;ve found that simply playing the part of the expert that I am, and confidently stating a price, is highly effective. If the figure is about what they were expecting, they&#039;ll happily accept. If it&#039;s a bit higher, they&#039;ll probably come back saying it&#039;s more than they expected; in which case you can negotiate: either adding value that won&#039;t cost you anything (maybe by throwing in a free report or similar), or removing value that will cost you (reducing the project&#039;s scope). And if it&#039;s way higher than they can pay, they&#039;ll probably say so, and you know the project isn&#039;t for you.

Anyhoo, I&#039;m looking forward to your further insights on this topic, as it&#039;s an area I can certainly improve myself!

Kind regards,
Bnonn</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great post Dean. I think the art of landing clients is one of the first things a freelance copywriter should seek to become an expert in. For one thing, copywriting is simply salesmanship in print&#8230;so if you can&#8217;t sell your own services, that&#8217;s gotta be a warning sign. For another thing, it&#8217;s kind of the key to running a successful business in the long term!</p>
<p>I find it incredibly important to set expectations early. Like you, I make my services &amp; rates available on my website, often send them to prospects when we first start talking. That way they don&#8217;t have much excuse to hum and har when I ask them for their budget.</p>
<p>Still, a lot do hedge. However, although Mike describes this as &#8220;waiting for me to blink&#8221;, I don&#8217;t think that&#8217;s usually what&#8217;s going on. In fact, I think prospects are generally much less &#8220;aggressive&#8221; that way than freelancers give them credit for. When they hedge, it&#8217;s because they actually see you as the expert and are, in a funny kind of way, &#8220;looking up to you&#8221;. And if they haven&#8217;t worked with someone like you before, then they genuinely aren&#8217;t sure what a reasonable budget is. Even though they almost certainly have a solid idea of what they can conceivably spend, they don&#8217;t want to actually say it for fear of seeming foolish.</p>
<p>Ironically, freelancers are often so unconfident themselves that they don&#8217;t see the prospect is looking to them for direction. They think he&#8217;s just trying to be cagey. I&#8217;ve found that simply playing the part of the expert that I am, and confidently stating a price, is highly effective. If the figure is about what they were expecting, they&#8217;ll happily accept. If it&#8217;s a bit higher, they&#8217;ll probably come back saying it&#8217;s more than they expected; in which case you can negotiate: either adding value that won&#8217;t cost you anything (maybe by throwing in a free report or similar), or removing value that will cost you (reducing the project&#8217;s scope). And if it&#8217;s way higher than they can pay, they&#8217;ll probably say so, and you know the project isn&#8217;t for you.</p>
<p>Anyhoo, I&#8217;m looking forward to your further insights on this topic, as it&#8217;s an area I can certainly improve myself!</p>
<p>Kind regards,<br />
Bnonn</p>
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		<title>By: Sara</title>
		<link>http://www.procopytips.com/client-fee-expectations/comment-page-1#comment-5977</link>
		<dc:creator>Sara</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Jul 2010 17:17:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.procopytips.com/?p=1431#comment-5977</guid>
		<description>This is a tough one! I asked a potential client the other day and he said &quot;It can&#039;t be too much or my boss will say no.&quot;

And that&#039;s all he would say...

A few months back I listed my minimum project fee on all my services pages, which seemed to help. At least I don&#039;t get as many calls for $3 article writing anymore.

Thanks for a great post!
-Sara</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is a tough one! I asked a potential client the other day and he said &#8220;It can&#8217;t be too much or my boss will say no.&#8221;</p>
<p>And that&#8217;s all he would say&#8230;</p>
<p>A few months back I listed my minimum project fee on all my services pages, which seemed to help. At least I don&#8217;t get as many calls for $3 article writing anymore.</p>
<p>Thanks for a great post!<br />
-Sara</p>
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		<title>By: Dean Rieck</title>
		<link>http://www.procopytips.com/client-fee-expectations/comment-page-1#comment-5975</link>
		<dc:creator>Dean Rieck</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Jul 2010 16:26:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.procopytips.com/?p=1431#comment-5975</guid>
		<description>Mike, 
There&#039;s more salesmanship to landing a client than most people realize. So there&#039;s no one way to close a deal. This is making me think that I need to deal with this topic a little more on this blog because it&#039;s one of those things none of us like to think about but all of us need to master.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mike,<br />
There&#8217;s more salesmanship to landing a client than most people realize. So there&#8217;s no one way to close a deal. This is making me think that I need to deal with this topic a little more on this blog because it&#8217;s one of those things none of us like to think about but all of us need to master.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Mike Klassen</title>
		<link>http://www.procopytips.com/client-fee-expectations/comment-page-1#comment-5974</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike Klassen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Jul 2010 16:17:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.procopytips.com/?p=1431#comment-5974</guid>
		<description>Great topic, Dean.  

The &quot;What&#039;s your budget?&quot; dance has driven me crazy as the most frequent answer I get is, &quot;Well, we&#039;re not quite sure yet. We&#039;re just exploring right now to understand what things cost.&quot; That may be true, but my feeling is often it&#039;s not... they do have a sense of what they will pay, but they want me to blink first.

One thing you can do at that point is ask them what they&#039;ve paid for past marketing projects, even if they&#039;re not exactly the same as what they&#039;re hiring you for.

If they hem and haw on that, then it could be a red flag for you.

These days, I ask prospects for the life-time value of a good customer. They&#039;re more willing to discuss that than a budget.

When I know that number, I&#039;m in a better position to know whether what they want me to do makes financial sense or whether I might suggest they consider something else.

This is a really basic example, but let&#039;s say the life-time value of a client for a consultant is $12,000 a year for 4 years. Your services are going to cost $5,000. How many clients need to be signed up from the marketing project to cover the $5,000? Just one, right?

Again, that&#039;s a really simple example. But what it does is to frame your price in the big picture and not just a $5,000 cost that is viewed as a separate entity.

I do think many freelancers take the position of &quot;follower&quot; in discussions like this instead of &quot;leader.&quot; I know I&#039;ve been guilty of that in the past.

You timidly give a price and cross your fingers that it will be OK rather than educating the prospect, and helping them see the big picture and how your price fits into it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great topic, Dean.  </p>
<p>The &#8220;What&#8217;s your budget?&#8221; dance has driven me crazy as the most frequent answer I get is, &#8220;Well, we&#8217;re not quite sure yet. We&#8217;re just exploring right now to understand what things cost.&#8221; That may be true, but my feeling is often it&#8217;s not&#8230; they do have a sense of what they will pay, but they want me to blink first.</p>
<p>One thing you can do at that point is ask them what they&#8217;ve paid for past marketing projects, even if they&#8217;re not exactly the same as what they&#8217;re hiring you for.</p>
<p>If they hem and haw on that, then it could be a red flag for you.</p>
<p>These days, I ask prospects for the life-time value of a good customer. They&#8217;re more willing to discuss that than a budget.</p>
<p>When I know that number, I&#8217;m in a better position to know whether what they want me to do makes financial sense or whether I might suggest they consider something else.</p>
<p>This is a really basic example, but let&#8217;s say the life-time value of a client for a consultant is $12,000 a year for 4 years. Your services are going to cost $5,000. How many clients need to be signed up from the marketing project to cover the $5,000? Just one, right?</p>
<p>Again, that&#8217;s a really simple example. But what it does is to frame your price in the big picture and not just a $5,000 cost that is viewed as a separate entity.</p>
<p>I do think many freelancers take the position of &#8220;follower&#8221; in discussions like this instead of &#8220;leader.&#8221; I know I&#8217;ve been guilty of that in the past.</p>
<p>You timidly give a price and cross your fingers that it will be OK rather than educating the prospect, and helping them see the big picture and how your price fits into it.</p>
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